From sjn at pvv.org Thu Jul 10 16:32:27 2008 From: sjn at pvv.org (Salve J Nilsen) Date: Thu, 10 Jul 2008 17:32:27 +0200 (CEST) Subject: [tap-l] Test Anything Protocol as an IETF draft/RFC In-Reply-To: References: <48511EF2.6080908@pvv.org> Message-ID: Lisa Dusseault said: > > Hi Salve, > > Since you mention the IETF Standards Track specifically, I guess you're > looking for a Proposed Standard RFC that has been published through the > IETF consensus process, which typically involves a Working Group (WG). Before continuing this, could we please have a couple of opinions expressed on the topic? (For posteriority, if nothing else.) Some of you have already said something positive (or mumbled something negative,) now let's get it into the archives. :) A simple +1, 0 or -1 with reason (the Apache way) should suffice. ------------------======oOo======------------------ Do we want to work for an IETF stamp of approval (presumably in the form of an RFC someday) on the TAP specification? +1 - Salve -- #!/usr/bin/perl sub AUTOLOAD{$AUTOLOAD=~/.*::(\d+)/;seek(DATA,$1,0);print# Salve Joshua Nilsen getc DATA}$"="'};&{'";@_=unpack("C*",unpack("u*",':4@,$'.# '2!--"5-(50P%$PL,!0X354UC-PP%/0\`'."\n"));eval "&{'@_'}"; __END__ is near! :) From andy at hexten.net Thu Jul 10 17:12:10 2008 From: andy at hexten.net (Andy Armstrong) Date: Thu, 10 Jul 2008 17:12:10 +0100 Subject: [tap-l] Test Anything Protocol as an IETF draft/RFC In-Reply-To: References: <48511EF2.6080908@pvv.org> Message-ID: On 10 Jul 2008, at 16:32, Salve J Nilsen wrote: > Lisa Dusseault said: >> >> Hi Salve, >> >> Since you mention the IETF Standards Track specifically, I guess >> you're >> looking for a Proposed Standard RFC that has been published through >> the >> IETF consensus process, which typically involves a Working Group >> (WG). > > Before continuing this, could we please have a couple of opinions > expressed on the topic? (For posteriority, if nothing else.) Some of > you > have already said something positive (or mumbled something > negative,) now > let's get it into the archives. :) > > A simple +1, 0 or -1 with reason (the Apache way) should suffice. > > ------------------======oOo======------------------ > > Do we want to work for an IETF stamp of approval (presumably in the > form > of an RFC someday) on the TAP specification? > > +1 +1 -- Andy Armstrong, Hexten From david at kineticode.com Thu Jul 10 17:56:13 2008 From: david at kineticode.com (David E. Wheeler) Date: Thu, 10 Jul 2008 09:56:13 -0700 Subject: [tap-l] Test Anything Protocol as an IETF draft/RFC In-Reply-To: References: <48511EF2.6080908@pvv.org> Message-ID: On Jul 10, 2008, at 08:32, Salve J Nilsen wrote: > Do we want to work for an IETF stamp of approval (presumably in the > form > of an RFC someday) on the TAP specification? > > +1 +1 David From jeremiah.foster at ericsson.com Thu Jul 10 17:46:47 2008 From: jeremiah.foster at ericsson.com (Jeremiah C. Foster) Date: Thu, 10 Jul 2008 18:46:47 +0200 Subject: [tap-l] Test Anything Protocol as an IETF draft/RFC In-Reply-To: References: <48511EF2.6080908@pvv.org> Message-ID: <1215708407.808.33.camel@seasc0551.dyn.rnd.as.sw.ericsson.se> On Thu, 2008-07-10 at 17:32 +0200, Salve J Nilsen wrote: > Lisa Dusseault said: > > > > Hi Salve, > > > > Since you mention the IETF Standards Track specifically, I guess you're > > looking for a Proposed Standard RFC that has been published through the > > IETF consensus process, which typically involves a Working Group (WG). > > Before continuing this, could we please have a couple of opinions > expressed on the topic? (For posteriority, if nothing else.) Some of you > have already said something positive (or mumbled something negative,) now > let's get it into the archives. :) > > A simple +1, 0 or -1 with reason (the Apache way) should suffice. > > ------------------======oOo======------------------ > > Do we want to work for an IETF stamp of approval (presumably in the form > of an RFC someday) on the TAP specification? > > +1 +1 - It is already widely used, a standard would be useful. Jeremiah From ss5 at renormalist.net Thu Jul 10 19:57:13 2008 From: ss5 at renormalist.net (Steffen Schwigon) Date: Thu, 10 Jul 2008 20:57:13 +0200 Subject: [tap-l] Test Anything Protocol as an IETF draft/RFC In-Reply-To: <1215708407.808.33.camel@seasc0551.dyn.rnd.as.sw.ericsson.se> (Jeremiah C. Foster's message of "Thu, 10 Jul 2008 18:46:47 +0200") References: <48511EF2.6080908@pvv.org> <1215708407.808.33.camel@seasc0551.dyn.rnd.as.sw.ericsson.se> Message-ID: <874p6xpnxy.fsf@shirts.quite-simply.de> "Jeremiah C. Foster" writes: >> Do we want to work for an IETF stamp of approval (presumably in the form >> of an RFC someday) on the TAP specification? >> >> +1 > > +1 - It is already widely used, a standard would be useful. +1 Steffen -- Steffen Schwigon From mpeters at plusthree.com Thu Jul 10 19:50:39 2008 From: mpeters at plusthree.com (Michael Peters) Date: Thu, 10 Jul 2008 14:50:39 -0400 Subject: [tap-l] Test Anything Protocol as an IETF draft/RFC In-Reply-To: References: <48511EF2.6080908@pvv.org> Message-ID: <487659FF.6090602@plusthree.com> Salve J Nilsen wrote: > A simple +1, 0 or -1 with reason (the Apache way) should suffice. > > ------------------======oOo======------------------ > > Do we want to work for an IETF stamp of approval (presumably in the form > of an RFC someday) on the TAP specification? +1 -- Michael Peters Plus Three, LP From pagaltzis at gmx.de Thu Jul 10 22:07:39 2008 From: pagaltzis at gmx.de (Aristotle Pagaltzis) Date: Thu, 10 Jul 2008 23:07:39 +0200 Subject: [tap-l] Test Anything Protocol as an IETF draft/RFC In-Reply-To: References: <48511EF2.6080908@pvv.org> Message-ID: <20080710210739.GD24253@klangraum.plasmasturm.org> * Salve J Nilsen [2008-07-10 18:10]: > Do we want to work for an IETF stamp of approval (presumably in > the form of an RFC someday) on the TAP specification? +1 Looks unanimous to me so far. Regards, -- Aristotle Pagaltzis // From publiustemp-tapx at yahoo.com Fri Jul 11 15:20:16 2008 From: publiustemp-tapx at yahoo.com (Ovid) Date: Fri, 11 Jul 2008 07:20:16 -0700 (PDT) Subject: [tap-l] Test Anything Protocol as an IETF draft/RFC In-Reply-To: Message-ID: <6515.40249.qm@web65701.mail.ac4.yahoo.com> --- On Thu, 10/7/08, Salve J Nilsen wrote: > A simple +1, 0 or -1 with reason (the Apache way) should > suffice. +1 -- Buy the book - http://www.oreilly.com/catalog/perlhks/ Tech blog - http://use.perl.org/~Ovid/journal/ Twitter - http://twitter.com/OvidPerl Official Perl 6 Wiki - http://www.perlfoundation.org/perl6 From robert at robertblackwell.com Fri Jul 11 15:23:03 2008 From: robert at robertblackwell.com (Robert Blackwell) Date: Fri, 11 Jul 2008 10:23:03 -0400 Subject: [tap-l] Test Anything Protocol as an IETF draft/RFC In-Reply-To: <6515.40249.qm@web65701.mail.ac4.yahoo.com> References: <6515.40249.qm@web65701.mail.ac4.yahoo.com> Message-ID: <48776CC7.8040105@robertblackwell.com> >> A simple +1, 0 or -1 with reason (the Apache way) should >> suffice. >> +1 From sjn at pvv.org Mon Jul 14 14:34:49 2008 From: sjn at pvv.org (Salve J Nilsen) Date: Mon, 14 Jul 2008 15:34:49 +0200 (CEST) Subject: [tap-l] Test Anything Protocol as an IETF draft/RFC In-Reply-To: References: <48511EF2.6080908@pvv.org> Message-ID: [Taking Harald off the Cc list] Lisa Dusseault said: > > Hi Salve, > [options] > > If you're looking to build a WG and build community awareness and > participation, I think TAP would be an excellent topic and I will > definitely help. Great! Very much appreciated. Nice if you could assist with answering a few questions. :) > The rough steps for forming a WG: > > - Create a mailing list under IETF contribution rules > (https://datatracker.ietf.org/list/request/) We already have a dedicated mailinglist (, with archives at .) In addition, there are still significant amounts of TAP-related discussions on the list where TAP originally was born (, with archives at .) Do we have to break up the existing tap-l mailinglist and create one under the ietf.org domain, or is it enough to declare the list as an "RFC 3978/4748 zone" where all members are required to accept the terms laid out in those documents? What options do we have? (I can't imagine this is a new issue :) > - Advertise the mailing list and the effort, and get participation -- > one might get people talking early about the proposals by publishing > them as Internet-Drafts and asking for input on the new list That shouldn't be too difficult to do with the existing documentation... > - Prepare a draft charter for a WG and discuss it on the new list I'd love it if you could tell me more about this (legal requirements? purpose? content requirements?) and if there are any documents we should read on this topic. > - Ask me for a BOF slot about 2 months in advance of the IETF meeting you > want to have the BOF at. Is there a public calendar of meetings somewhere? Actually, is there a list of documents that are useful to be familiar with when starting this process? (I've seen RFC 3978 and 3979 mentioned at least.) Any pointers would be appreciated. - Salve -- #!/usr/bin/perl sub AUTOLOAD{$AUTOLOAD=~/.*::(\d+)/;seek(DATA,$1,0);print# Salve Joshua Nilsen getc DATA}$"="'};&{'";@_=unpack("C*",unpack("u*",':4@,$'.# '2!--"5-(50P%$PL,!0X354UC-PP%/0\`'."\n"));eval "&{'@_'}"; __END__ is near! :) From lisa at osafoundation.org Mon Jul 14 17:39:47 2008 From: lisa at osafoundation.org (Lisa Dusseault) Date: Mon, 14 Jul 2008 09:39:47 -0700 Subject: [tap-l] Test Anything Protocol as an IETF draft/RFC In-Reply-To: References: <48511EF2.6080908@pvv.org> Message-ID: On Jul 14, 2008, at 6:34 AM, Salve J Nilsen wrote: > > Do we have to break up the existing tap-l mailinglist and create one > under the ietf.org domain, or is it enough to declare the list as an > "RFC 3978/4748 zone" where all members are required to accept the > terms laid out in those documents? > > What options do we have? (I can't imagine this is a new issue :) At some point, it would be good to move to an IETF.org domain. There's a variety of reasons: - We've had some problems in the past with archives becoming unavailable, that's very bad because IETF mailing list history is important for legal reasons - The IETF has spam filters (and is working on developing more) that work best in our environment. E.g. anybody who is a legitimate participant in any list should be able to post on any other list without having to subscribe to it -- their emails should not be blocked as spam. - Although it seems reasonable to declare off-IETF lists as falling under IETF policy, it's more clear for sites really hosted by IETF There is currently a proposal to move all IETF WG mailing lists to the IETF domain. Of course this is only at the proposal stage, and doesn't affect efforts that are not yet WGs. However, if TAP becomes a WG I highly recommend IETF hosting for the discussion lists. Timing, however, is a real tradeoff. It would be annoying to move list location now only to decide collectively later not to form an IETF WG. OTOH it's easier to get a successful move done early before more people join. I have no good recommendations about timing now or later! I believe archives and membership lists can be moved if the discussion does move. > > > >> - Prepare a draft charter for a WG and discuss it on the new list > > I'd love it if you could tell me more about this (legal > requirements? purpose? content requirements?) and if there are any > documents we should read on this topic. The purpose is to direct and even restrict the work a WG engages in. A new charter is sent for IETF-wide review, so it's considered to be an IETF consensus document, a decision to take on certain work and form a WG. After that, it's primarily a tool used by the chair to keep people on track. It's not an immutable document -- the WG can propose changing its charter and if the changes are substantial the rest of the IETF may get another look at it. A good start at a charter is just to say informally what the WG is supposed to accomplish and list what RFCs should be published. Later that can be written up in the idiosyncratic IETF format. > > > >> - Ask me for a BOF slot about 2 months in advance of the IETF >> meeting you want to have the BOF at. > > Is there a public calendar of meetings somewhere? http://www.ietf.org/meetings/0mtg-sites.txt > > > Actually, is there a list of documents that are useful to be > familiar with when starting this process? (I've seen RFC 3978 and > 3979 mentioned at least.) Any pointers would be appreciated. The Tao of IETF provides an introduction and pointers. http://www.ietf.org/tao.html Thanks, Lisa From david at kineticode.com Mon Jul 14 19:07:40 2008 From: david at kineticode.com (David E. Wheeler) Date: Mon, 14 Jul 2008 11:07:40 -0700 Subject: [tap-l] Test Anything Protocol as an IETF draft/RFC In-Reply-To: References: <48511EF2.6080908@pvv.org> Message-ID: On Jul 14, 2008, at 09:39, Lisa Dusseault wrote: >> What options do we have? (I can't imagine this is a new issue :) > > At some point, it would be good to move to an IETF.org domain. Seems okay to me. We should keep tap-l for discussion of development and whatnot, and use the IETF mail list just for discussion specific to creating a draft. Make sense? Best, David From paul at pjcj.net Mon Jul 14 20:06:31 2008 From: paul at pjcj.net (Paul Johnson) Date: Mon, 14 Jul 2008 21:06:31 +0200 Subject: [tap-l] Test Anything Protocol as an IETF draft/RFC In-Reply-To: References: <48511EF2.6080908@pvv.org> Message-ID: <20080714190631.GA10998@pjcj.net> On Thu, Jul 10, 2008 at 05:32:27PM +0200, Salve J Nilsen wrote: > Do we want to work for an IETF stamp of approval (presumably in the form > of an RFC someday) on the TAP specification? +1 I had a few concerns about this, but having researched it a little more thoroughly I can see a number of advantages and no disadvantages that should overly concern us. -- Paul Johnson - paul at pjcj.net http://www.pjcj.net From sjn at pvv.org Mon Jul 21 12:13:08 2008 From: sjn at pvv.org (Salve J Nilsen) Date: Mon, 21 Jul 2008 13:13:08 +0200 (CEST) Subject: [tap-l] Test Anything Protocol as an IETF draft/RFC In-Reply-To: References: <48511EF2.6080908@pvv.org> Message-ID: David E. Wheeler said: > On Jul 14, 2008, at 09:39, Lisa Dusseault wrote: > >>> What options do we have? (I can't imagine this is a new issue :) >> >> At some point, it would be good to move to an IETF.org domain. > > Seems okay to me. We should keep tap-l for discussion of development and > whatnot, and use the IETF mail list just for discussion specific to > creating a draft. Make sense? I'm thinking that separating the discussions about the draft from the implementation details (and experiences and lessons) might not be a good thing. I'm afraid that only the "spec theorists" would join the IETF list and that the guys using and developing TAP tools stay in tap-l, increasing the likelyhood that important implementation details won't be communicated to the "spec theorists." (We actually had a situation like at the Perl QA Hackathon, where a spec on day 1 was found to be too difficult to implement on day 2, and if the "spec theorists" of day 1 weren't the same people who were going to implement it on day, we wouldn't have catched it so quickly.) Perhaps I'm worrying too much. Has there been any similar headaches earlier within the IETF workgroups? - Salve -- #!/usr/bin/perl sub AUTOLOAD{$AUTOLOAD=~/.*::(\d+)/;seek(DATA,$1,0);print# Salve Joshua Nilsen getc DATA}$"="'};&{'";@_=unpack("C*",unpack("u*",':4@,$'.# '2!--"5-(50P%$PL,!0X354UC-PP%/0\`'."\n"));eval "&{'@_'}"; __END__ is near! :) From lisa at osafoundation.org Tue Jul 22 04:51:00 2008 From: lisa at osafoundation.org (Lisa Dusseault) Date: Mon, 21 Jul 2008 20:51:00 -0700 Subject: [tap-l] Test Anything Protocol as an IETF draft/RFC In-Reply-To: References: <48511EF2.6080908@pvv.org> Message-ID: <2D8807A7-A911-4F08-A2F7-3DD9A9656E54@osafoundation.org> That's a fair concern, but I can't say that I've seen that pitfall for certain. I worried about the same thing in the calendaring area with the CalConnect consortium where implementors come and do interoperability events and talk to customers, and the CALSIFY WG where the specs get written-- and that's not just two lists but about half a dozen in CalConnect plus the CALSIFY list. Seems to be working so far. FWIW, there's no reason why developers can't join the same IETF list as the "spec theorists". If the WG chair finds the overall traffic level to be manageable and reasonable progress made on the specs when that's needed, then the lists can usefully include topics other than what the specs should say. I say this as somebody who is not always just a spec theorist :) We can also schedule hackathons or interop test events in and around the IETF should that ever become desirable. Lisa On Jul 21, 2008, at 4:13 AM, Salve J Nilsen wrote: > David E. Wheeler said: >> On Jul 14, 2008, at 09:39, Lisa Dusseault wrote: >> >>>> What options do we have? (I can't imagine this is a new issue :) >>> >>> At some point, it would be good to move to an IETF.org domain. >> >> Seems okay to me. We should keep tap-l for discussion of >> development and whatnot, and use the IETF mail list just for >> discussion specific to creating a draft. Make sense? > > I'm thinking that separating the discussions about the draft from > the implementation details (and experiences and lessons) might not > be a good thing. I'm afraid that only the "spec theorists" would > join the IETF list and that the guys using and developing TAP tools > stay in tap-l, increasing the likelyhood that important > implementation details won't be communicated to the "spec > theorists." (We actually had a situation like at the Perl QA > Hackathon, where a spec on day 1 was found to be too difficult to > implement on day 2, and if the "spec theorists" of day 1 weren't the > same people who were going to implement it on day, we wouldn't have > catched it so quickly.) > > Perhaps I'm worrying too much. > > Has there been any similar headaches earlier within the IETF > workgroups? > > > - Salve > > -- > #!/usr/bin/perl > sub AUTOLOAD{$AUTOLOAD=~/.*::(\d+)/;seek(DATA,$1,0);print# Salve > Joshua Nilsen > getc DATA}$"="'};&{'";@_=unpack("C*",unpack("u*",':4@,$'.# > > '2!--"5-(50P%$PL,!0X354UC-PP%/0\`'."\n"));eval "&{'@_'}"; __END__ > is near! :) From sjn at pvv.org Wed Jul 23 10:47:11 2008 From: sjn at pvv.org (Salve J Nilsen) Date: Wed, 23 Jul 2008 11:47:11 +0200 (CEST) Subject: [tap-l] Vote for list creation (Was: Test Anything Protocol as an IETF draft/RFC) In-Reply-To: References: <48511EF2.6080908@pvv.org> Message-ID: David E. Wheeler said: > On Jul 14, 2008, at 09:39, Lisa Dusseault wrote: > >>> What options do we have? (I can't imagine this is a new issue :) >> >> At some point, it would be good to move to an IETF.org domain. > > Seems okay to me. We should keep tap-l for discussion of development > and whatnot, and use the IETF mail list just for discussion specific > to creating a draft. Make sense? Yep. Let's see if we can move this along... I propose the following (please give +1/0/-1 votes/vetos to each point): 1. We have IETF (Lisa/Chris) set up a mailing list for TAP draft development, preferrably something with "tap" or "testanything" as part of the name. 2. Those of us interested, join the list and start writing an initial draft, good enough to be presented at the fall 2008 IETF meeting on November 16-21 (Hosted by Google in Minneapolis, MN, USA.) We'll figure out the details on how to do this on the new list. 3. If you'd like to nominate someone for chair, then give your vote here. - Salve -- #!/usr/bin/perl sub AUTOLOAD{$AUTOLOAD=~/.*::(\d+)/;seek(DATA,$1,0);print# Salve Joshua Nilsen getc DATA}$"="'};&{'";@_=unpack("C*",unpack("u*",':4@,$'.# '2!--"5-(50P%$PL,!0X354UC-PP%/0\`'."\n"));eval "&{'@_'}"; __END__ is near! :) From andy at hexten.net Wed Jul 23 10:49:38 2008 From: andy at hexten.net (Andy Armstrong) Date: Wed, 23 Jul 2008 10:49:38 +0100 Subject: [tap-l] Vote for list creation (Was: Test Anything Protocol as an IETF draft/RFC) In-Reply-To: References: <48511EF2.6080908@pvv.org> Message-ID: On 23 Jul 2008, at 10:47, Salve J Nilsen wrote: > Yep. Let's see if we can move this along... I propose the following > (please give +1/0/-1 votes/vetos to each point): > > 1. We have IETF (Lisa/Chris) set up a mailing list for TAP draft > development, preferrably something with "tap" or > "testanything" as part of the name. +1 > 2. Those of us interested, join the list and start writing an initial > draft, good enough to be presented at the fall 2008 IETF meeting on > November 16-21 (Hosted by Google in Minneapolis, MN, USA.) We'll > figure > out the details on how to do this on the new list. +1 > 3. If you'd like to nominate someone for chair, then give your vote > here. Salve :) (assuming you're up for nomination) -- Andy Armstrong, Hexten From sjn at pvv.org Wed Jul 23 11:01:29 2008 From: sjn at pvv.org (Salve J Nilsen) Date: Wed, 23 Jul 2008 12:01:29 +0200 (CEST) Subject: [tap-l] Vote for list creation (Was: Test Anything Protocol as an IETF draft/RFC) In-Reply-To: References: <48511EF2.6080908@pvv.org> Message-ID: Salve J Nilsen said: > > 1. We have IETF (Lisa/Chris) set up a mailing list for TAP draft > development, preferrably something with "tap" or > "testanything" as part of the name. Uhnf. I'm sorry, I meant to say Lisa/David. :-P - Salve, who has no idea what happened there. -- #!/usr/bin/perl sub AUTOLOAD{$AUTOLOAD=~/.*::(\d+)/;seek(DATA,$1,0);print# Salve Joshua Nilsen getc DATA}$"="'};&{'";@_=unpack("C*",unpack("u*",':4@,$'.# '2!--"5-(50P%$PL,!0X354UC-PP%/0\`'."\n"));eval "&{'@_'}"; __END__ is near! :) From publiustemp-tapx at yahoo.com Wed Jul 23 12:09:49 2008 From: publiustemp-tapx at yahoo.com (Ovid) Date: Wed, 23 Jul 2008 04:09:49 -0700 (PDT) Subject: [tap-l] Vote for list creation (Was: Test Anything Protocol as an IETF draft/RFC) In-Reply-To: Message-ID: <917710.75492.qm@web65701.mail.ac4.yahoo.com> --- On Wed, 23/7/08, Salve J Nilsen wrote: > 1. We have IETF (Lisa/Chris) set up a mailing list for TAP > draft > development, preferrably something with "tap" > or > "testanything" as part of the name. +1 > 2. Those of us interested, join the list and start writing > an initial > draft, good enough to be presented at the fall 2008 > IETF meeting on > November 16-21 (Hosted by Google in Minneapolis, MN, > USA.) We'll figure > out the details on how to do this on the new list. +1 > 3. If you'd like to nominate someone for chair, then > give your vote here. Salve :) Cheers, Ovid -- Buy the book - http://www.oreilly.com/catalog/perlhks/ Tech blog - http://use.perl.org/~Ovid/journal/ Twitter - http://twitter.com/OvidPerl Official Perl 6 Wiki - http://www.perlfoundation.org/perl6 From shlomif at iglu.org.il Wed Jul 23 14:41:09 2008 From: shlomif at iglu.org.il (Shlomi Fish) Date: Wed, 23 Jul 2008 16:41:09 +0300 Subject: [tap-l] Vote for list creation (Was: Test Anything Protocol as an IETF draft/RFC) In-Reply-To: References: <48511EF2.6080908@pvv.org> Message-ID: <200807231641.10098.shlomif@iglu.org.il> On Wednesday 23 July 2008, Salve J Nilsen wrote: > David E. Wheeler said: > > On Jul 14, 2008, at 09:39, Lisa Dusseault wrote: > >>> What options do we have? (I can't imagine this is a new issue :) > >> > >> At some point, it would be good to move to an IETF.org domain. > > > > Seems okay to me. We should keep tap-l for discussion of development > > and whatnot, and use the IETF mail list just for discussion specific > > to creating a draft. Make sense? > > Yep. Let's see if we can move this along... I propose the following > (please give +1/0/-1 votes/vetos to each point): > > 1. We have IETF (Lisa/Chris) set up a mailing list for TAP draft > development, preferrably something with "tap" or > "testanything" as part of the name. +1 > > 2. Those of us interested, join the list and start writing an initial > draft, good enough to be presented at the fall 2008 IETF meeting on > November 16-21 (Hosted by Google in Minneapolis, MN, USA.) We'll figure > out the details on how to do this on the new list. > +1 Regards, Shlomi Fish ----------------------------------------------------------------- Shlomi Fish http://www.shlomifish.org/ Rethinking CPAN - http://xrl.us/bjn7p I met a guy in the bar, talked to her and she gave me her phone number. From mpeters at plusthree.com Wed Jul 23 15:45:10 2008 From: mpeters at plusthree.com (Michael Peters) Date: Wed, 23 Jul 2008 10:45:10 -0400 Subject: [tap-l] Vote for list creation (Was: Test Anything Protocol as an IETF draft/RFC) In-Reply-To: References: <48511EF2.6080908@pvv.org> Message-ID: <488743F6.5000407@plusthree.com> Salve J Nilsen wrote: > 1. We have IETF (Lisa/Chris) set up a mailing list for TAP draft > development, preferrably something with "tap" or > "testanything" as part of the name. +1 > 2. Those of us interested, join the list and start writing an initial > draft, good enough to be presented at the fall 2008 IETF meeting on > November 16-21 (Hosted by Google in Minneapolis, MN, USA.) We'll figure > out the details on how to do this on the new list. +1 > 3. If you'd like to nominate someone for chair, then give your vote here. Salve -- Michael Peters Plus Three, LP From ss5 at renormalist.net Wed Jul 23 15:55:51 2008 From: ss5 at renormalist.net (Steffen Schwigon) Date: Wed, 23 Jul 2008 16:55:51 +0200 Subject: [tap-l] Vote for list creation In-Reply-To: (Salve J. Nilsen's message of "Wed, 23 Jul 2008 11:47:11 +0200 (CEST)") References: <48511EF2.6080908@pvv.org> Message-ID: <87fxq0wsy0.fsf@shirts.quite-simply.de> Salve J Nilsen writes: > David E. Wheeler said: >> On Jul 14, 2008, at 09:39, Lisa Dusseault wrote: >> >>>> What options do we have? (I can't imagine this is a new issue :) >>> >>> At some point, it would be good to move to an IETF.org domain. >> >> Seems okay to me. We should keep tap-l for discussion of development >> and whatnot, and use the IETF mail list just for discussion specific >> to creating a draft. Make sense? > > Yep. Let's see if we can move this along... I propose the following > (please give +1/0/-1 votes/vetos to each point): > > 1. We have IETF (Lisa/Chris) set up a mailing list for TAP draft > development, preferrably something with "tap" or > "testanything" as part of the name. +1 > > 2. Those of us interested, join the list and start writing an initial > draft, good enough to be presented at the fall 2008 IETF meeting on > November 16-21 (Hosted by Google in Minneapolis, MN, USA.) We'll figure > out the details on how to do this on the new list. +1 > > 3. If you'd like to nominate someone for chair, then give your vote here. Salve :-) Regards, Steffen -- Steffen Schwigon Dresden Perl Mongers Deutscher Perl-Workshop From david at kineticode.com Wed Jul 23 16:50:06 2008 From: david at kineticode.com (David E. Wheeler) Date: Wed, 23 Jul 2008 08:50:06 -0700 Subject: [tap-l] Vote for list creation (Was: Test Anything Protocol as an IETF draft/RFC) In-Reply-To: References: <48511EF2.6080908@pvv.org> Message-ID: <4A7DB803-3704-4013-8DD1-1451F1F95072@kineticode.com> On Jul 23, 2008, at 02:47, Salve J Nilsen wrote: > 1. We have IETF (Lisa/Chris) set up a mailing list for TAP draft > development, preferrably something with "tap" or > "testanything" as part of the name. +1 > 2. Those of us interested, join the list and start writing an initial > draft, good enough to be presented at the fall 2008 IETF meeting on > November 16-21 (Hosted by Google in Minneapolis, MN, USA.) We'll > figure > out the details on how to do this on the new list. +1 > 3. If you'd like to nominate someone for chair, then give your vote > here. Salve Schwern Andy Armstrong Best, David From pagaltzis at gmx.de Wed Jul 23 22:24:33 2008 From: pagaltzis at gmx.de (Aristotle Pagaltzis) Date: Wed, 23 Jul 2008 23:24:33 +0200 Subject: [tap-l] Vote for list creation (Was: Test Anything Protocol as an IETF draft/RFC) In-Reply-To: References: <48511EF2.6080908@pvv.org> Message-ID: <20080723212433.GB30413@klangraum.plasmasturm.org> * Salve J Nilsen [2008-07-23 11:50]: > 1. We have IETF (Lisa/Chris) set up a mailing list for TAP > draft development, preferrably something with "tap" or > "testanything" as part of the name. +1 > 2. Those of us interested, join the list and start writing an > initial draft, good enough to be presented at the fall 2008 > IETF meeting on November 16-21 (Hosted by Google in > Minneapolis, MN, USA.) We'll figure out the details on how > to do this on the new list. +1 > 3. If you'd like to nominate someone for chair, then give your > vote here. Salve :-) AndyA Regards, -- Aristotle Pagaltzis // From sjn at pvv.org Wed Jul 30 16:58:13 2008 From: sjn at pvv.org (Salve J Nilsen) Date: Wed, 30 Jul 2008 18:58:13 +0200 (CEST) Subject: [tap-l] Test Anything Protocol as an IETF draft/RFC In-Reply-To: References: <48511EF2.6080908@pvv.org> Message-ID: Lisa Dusseault said: > > At some point, it would be good to move to an IETF.org domain. There's a concensus for this (at least among the votes last week.) Can you can set up a list for us right now (preferrably something with the words "tap" or "testanything" in it,) or do we have to do something else first? (e.g. decide upon a charter or have specific roles filled.) On a side note, I've set up an initial wiki page on testanything.org for notes about what needs to be done. Have a look, and if you know of something useful to add, feel free to go ahead. :) - Salve -- #!/usr/bin/perl sub AUTOLOAD{$AUTOLOAD=~/.*::(\d+)/;seek(DATA,$1,0);print# Salve Joshua Nilsen getc DATA}$"="'};&{'";@_=unpack("C*",unpack("u*",':4@,$'.# '2!--"5-(50P%$PL,!0X354UC-PP%/0\`'."\n"));eval "&{'@_'}"; __END__ is near! :) From sjn at pvv.org Thu Jul 31 12:33:29 2008 From: sjn at pvv.org (Salve J Nilsen) Date: Thu, 31 Jul 2008 14:33:29 +0200 (CEST) Subject: [tap-l] TAP BOF at YAPC::EU? Message-ID: Hey guys. I suggest a TAP BOF at YAPC::EU in two weeks time. I'm guessing there are a few topics that would be useful to talk about (come with your suggestions if you are attending the conference,) and one obvious is wording the charter for the IETF WG. Anyone up for it? - Salve -- #!/usr/bin/perl sub AUTOLOAD{$AUTOLOAD=~/.*::(\d+)/;seek(DATA,$1,0);print# Salve Joshua Nilsen getc DATA}$"="'};&{'";@_=unpack("C*",unpack("u*",':4@,$'.# '2!--"5-(50P%$PL,!0X354UC-PP%/0\`'."\n"));eval "&{'@_'}"; __END__ is near! :) From publiustemp-tapx at yahoo.com Thu Jul 31 12:38:17 2008 From: publiustemp-tapx at yahoo.com (Ovid) Date: Thu, 31 Jul 2008 05:38:17 -0700 (PDT) Subject: [tap-l] TAP BOF at YAPC::EU? In-Reply-To: Message-ID: <827792.8891.qm@web65716.mail.ac4.yahoo.com> --- On Thu, 31/7/08, Salve J Nilsen wrote: > I suggest a TAP BOF at YAPC::EU in two weeks time. I'm > guessing there are > a few topics that would be useful to talk about (come with > your > suggestions if you are attending the conference,) and one > obvious is > wording the charter for the IETF WG. > > Anyone up for it? Yes. That sounds great to me. Cheers, Ovid -- Buy the book - http://www.oreilly.com/catalog/perlhks/ Tech blog - http://use.perl.org/~Ovid/journal/ Twitter - http://twitter.com/OvidPerl Official Perl 6 Wiki - http://www.perlfoundation.org/perl6 From andy at hexten.net Thu Jul 31 12:52:56 2008 From: andy at hexten.net (Andy Armstrong) Date: Thu, 31 Jul 2008 13:52:56 +0100 Subject: [tap-l] TAP BOF at YAPC::EU? In-Reply-To: <827792.8891.qm@web65716.mail.ac4.yahoo.com> References: <827792.8891.qm@web65716.mail.ac4.yahoo.com> Message-ID: <9B288C61-B0EA-4D7C-92C7-2A0633F1A451@hexten.net> On 31 Jul 2008, at 13:38, Ovid wrote: >> Anyone up for it? > > Yes. That sounds great to me. +1 :) -- Andy Armstrong, Hexten From h.m.brand at xs4all.nl Thu Jul 31 13:30:01 2008 From: h.m.brand at xs4all.nl (H.Merijn Brand) Date: Thu, 31 Jul 2008 15:30:01 +0200 Subject: [tap-l] TAP BOF at YAPC::EU? In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <20080731153001.30266dee@pc09.procura.nl> On Thu, 31 Jul 2008 14:33:29 +0200 (CEST), Salve J Nilsen wrote: > Hey guys. > > I suggest a TAP BOF at YAPC::EU in two weeks time. I'm guessing there are > a few topics that would be useful to talk about (come with your > suggestions if you are attending the conference,) and one obvious is > wording the charter for the IETF WG. > > Anyone up for it? +1, if only just to meet face-to-face again. -- H.Merijn Brand Amsterdam Perl Mongers http://amsterdam.pm.org/ using & porting perl 5.6.2, 5.8.x, 5.10.x, 5.11.x on HP-UX 10.20, 11.00, 11.11, 11.23, and 11.31, SuSE 10.1, 10.2, and 10.3, AIX 5.2, and Cygwin. http://mirrors.develooper.com/hpux/ http://www.test-smoke.org/ http://qa.perl.org http://www.goldmark.org/jeff/stupid-disclaimers/ From paul at pjcj.net Thu Jul 31 17:37:36 2008 From: paul at pjcj.net (Paul Johnson) Date: Thu, 31 Jul 2008 19:37:36 +0200 Subject: [tap-l] TAP BOF at YAPC::EU? In-Reply-To: <20080731153001.30266dee@pc09.procura.nl> References: <20080731153001.30266dee@pc09.procura.nl> Message-ID: <20080731173736.GI15114@pjcj.net> On Thu, Jul 31, 2008 at 03:30:01PM +0200, H.Merijn Brand wrote: > On Thu, 31 Jul 2008 14:33:29 +0200 (CEST), Salve J Nilsen > wrote: > > I suggest a TAP BOF at YAPC::EU in two weeks time. > > Anyone up for it? > > +1, if only just to meet face-to-face again. I'll be there. -- Paul Johnson - paul at pjcj.net http://www.pjcj.net